Episode 12
Women’s Healthspan, Longevity Hype and Building Credible Health Businesses with Corinne Briaud Manon
On Beyond Longevity, Corinne Briaud Manon discusses women’s healthspan through the lenses of science, consumer trust and commercial execution, drawing on her experience in major corporates and her work across Green Marlin, which advises health and longevity startups, and LongHER, a women’s healthspan community platform.
She explains how the two initiatives connect, including how startups can test their propositions with real consumers, and outlines common early-stage pitfalls such as focusing too much on technical detail and not enough on real consumer need, lacking competitive awareness and structure, and letting passion override business discipline.
The conversation explores what “science-backed” should really mean, why longevity is currently a kind of wild west with real credibility risks, and why women’s health needs to become a serious business if it is to address historic underinvestment.
Corinne emphasises the importance of getting the basics right first for women, including basic health assessments, body composition, sleep, movement, strength and social connection, rather than spending blindly on superficial solutions. She also points out that access remains skewed towards the privileged and that prevention will need to be properly incentivised if it is to reach the masses.
Instagram: @longher_collective
https://www.linkedin.com/in/corinne-briaud-manon/
00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro
01:38 Two Ventures Overview
02:43 Ecosystem Linking Both
04:17 How Longher Helps Startups
06:20 Green Marlin Origin Story
07:39 Startup Gaps and Fixes
11:48 Passion Versus Business
13:00 Spotting Real Innovation
14:44 Authenticity in Longevity Clinics
16:53 From Lab to Market
18:53 What Science Backed Means
20:56 Longevity Wild West
24:09 Why Womens Health Must Scale
28:01 Workplace Healthspan Shift
28:30 Workplace Health Costs
29:19 Menopause Support Programs
30:57 Women Led Health Startups
32:09 Beauty Versus Longevity Hype
33:54 Muscle Health Foundations
35:29 Where To Begin Basics
39:17 Stop Wasting On Superficial
41:14 Longevity Access Inequality
45:19 Prevention Model Shift
50:02 Future Of Longevity Trust
51:49 Rapid Fire Takeaways
55:32 Closing Reflections
Transcript
Foreign.
Speaker B:Welcome to Beyond Longevity, the podcast that explores not just how we age, but how we can build a longer, healthier future for ourselves.
Speaker B:My guest today is Corinne Briard Manon.
Speaker B:Corinne brings a very different perspective to the longevity conversation.
Speaker B:She has spent many years inside major health and well being businesses, helped build brands in the sector and now works on both sides of the market as co founder of Longhorn, a platform which focuses on women's healthspan and through Green Marlin, where she advises health and longevity companies on strategy, growth and execution.
Speaker B:So this conversation is not just about women's health and it is not just about longevity as an idea.
Speaker B:It is about what happens when science becomes promising products, when health becomes a market, and when women are asked to navigate a space that is becoming more crowded, more commercial, and not always easier to trust.
Speaker B:We talk about where women's longevity is making real progress, where hype is getting ahead of substance, what companies still get wrong, and how women can tell the difference between something genuinely useful and something simply well marketed.
Speaker B:Hi Corinne, thank you so much for joining me today on Beyond Longevity.
Speaker B:I usually ask my guests to start at the beginning of their career and explain how they got to where they are now.
Speaker B:But I'd love with you just to do it the other way around and jump right in where you're at because I think not too long ago you co founded two separate businesses, Green Marlin and Longhe, two very different businesses.
Speaker B:One, Green Marlin is an advisory business for health and longevity companies focusing on strategy, positioning, growth and operational discipline.
Speaker B:And Longhir is a platform that helps women and focuses on advancing women's health through science, education and general community.
Speaker C:That's a good summary.
Speaker B:Good start.
Speaker B:How and why did you feel a need for those two separate entities?
Speaker C:So I think the only caveat I would have to what you just said is the way I view them is they are not fully separate.
Speaker C:So we are part of one ecosystem which is all about advancing healthspan because the startups or companies I advise are often partners in the longer adventure we built with my business partner based in New York.
Speaker C:So if I talk a bit about longer, yes, it's a platform, but it's a community based platform where we gather experts who can be medical doctors, researchers, coaches.
Speaker C:We gather also businesses and that's where you know, the healthcare companies I advise can come in.
Speaker C:And we advise, of course, women who are keen to understand how to prolong their health span.
Speaker C:So the two companies are not fully separate.
Speaker C:One is more like, I would say, a community we activate and the other one is also the work we do with some of these startups in helping them achieve their objective of advancing healthspan.
Speaker C:So very much interconnected.
Speaker B:You actually already answered a question that I would have asked you otherwise, which is exactly sort of that, because on one hand you are advising businesses, but on the other hand you're also maybe not advising, but helping their potential clients.
Speaker B:So how does that work?
Speaker C:In reality, the businesses I work with are often businesses which are at the stage of wanting to scale up or early stage of have already.
Speaker C:They've already done so, but they need to go and find investors.
Speaker C:Often these companies are funded by people coming from the scientific world.
Speaker C:And when they go and look for money to invest in their business, they face very often different types of people, right?
Speaker C:Investors coming from a financial world.
Speaker C:And, and so I advise them on definitely how to frame their strategy and how to go and reach consumers.
Speaker C:Because most of the businesses I work with are direct to consumer or consumer oriented businesses.
Speaker C:So B2C.
Speaker C:And so one of the opportunities I give them is to be exposed to some of their consumers for longer.
Speaker C:Sometimes it's about testing, in fact, some of the hypotheses that they have.
Speaker C:So for example, at the longer event that we organized in Lausanne, we had a longevity clinic which attended.
Speaker C:They were not open yet, but they wanted to meet some of the women who are the target audience and they wanted to ask them some questions, understand how to frame the proposition in the best way.
Speaker C:So it can be this way, but it's also longer can be a platform for them as well to expand awareness, expand trial.
Speaker C:So we offer them that opportunity.
Speaker C:It's also a great way for them to form alliances with whether some of the doctors who are there, but also some of the other brand partners who join.
Speaker C:So we help them sometimes validate some of their processes, sometimes also enrich their plans.
Speaker C:And that is something that can be part of a pitch to investors or that can help them grow their business.
Speaker C:That's why it's definitely linked and that's why they see a benefit in participating to both.
Speaker B:It's very smart.
Speaker B:I want to talk about Green Marlin a little bit more, but let me ask you first, another question.
Speaker B:What came first, the Longhorn platform or the Green Marlin platform?
Speaker C:So Green Marlin came first.
Speaker C:Green Marlin appeared after I ended, maybe not for, you know, forever, but at least for now, my career in big corporates and when I started, in fact, advising some companies in consumer health.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Leveraging my, my all the insights and learnings and expertise from the big corporate group.
Speaker C:So that's why it came first.
Speaker C:In fact, the first time I did some advisory was with a longevity focused company and that's how the whole longevity thing started.
Speaker C:I joined the company for good and then went back to advisory and then I would say long hair came second.
Speaker C:Even though I think that the whole idea had matured for many years, even though I didn't really know about it.
Speaker C:So it was an unconscious idea.
Speaker C:But in terms of the real, I would say frames, Green Marlin came first.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:You've been very humble about your, your previous career.
Speaker B:I mean, just to call it out, you were working for what, 20, 25 years at some of the biggest companies.
Speaker B:You know, they are Procter Gamble, GSK, Nestler Skin Health.
Speaker B:So you really know what you're talking about.
Speaker B:What did you feel was missing in the startup field, early growth phase of these health and longevity businesses?
Speaker B:Where, why did you feel you could help them?
Speaker C:I think most of these companies, so they have an amazing idea or an amazing product or an amazing service.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:It often comes from research or technical investigation and sometimes they haven't validated the consumer needs first.
Speaker C:So they may have something absolutely amazing, but they haven't validated yet.
Speaker C:Or they are also missing the structure.
Speaker C:And so we can talk about ours, about the technical great product, but they can't talk about how much it's going to bring to the investors.
Speaker C:What's the time frame for implementing new solutions, new initiatives, what's the pipeline?
Speaker C:So all the terms that investors want to listen to.
Speaker C:So I'm going to give an example.
Speaker C:I worked with a company based in France.
Speaker C:They invented an AI powered messaging robot.
Speaker C:And the objective is not to replace human masseurs, but to complement in fact, the massage therapy, which is in the Western world very much underestimated many reasons why you can't have message therapy.
Speaker C:Often you don't find the people, it can be costly, you can't book when you need to and all that.
Speaker C:So they thought, okay, maybe a machine there can support that.
Speaker A:So they worked on that.
Speaker C:It's a couple, both of them coming from the engineering world.
Speaker C:And so when I started working with them, they talked to me for hours about their product, about, you know, the way it's done, the AI prototype and how it's working, the platform and everything.
Speaker C:And they were looking at the same time for investments.
Speaker C:And I was like, first, I don't understand much of what you're talking about.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:I know, it's great.
Speaker C:Let me try to understand the consumer needs, how you answer These needs, what is the benefit, how you're going to get your investors understand they can make money.
Speaker C:So what's your distribution strategy and all that.
Speaker C:So it's just one example of once you've been many years in a corporate world and you've been trained to look holistically at how to grow a business, you can help the startup.
Speaker B:Do you think that a lot of the founders get the same things wrong when they come to you, or is it sort of, you know, everybody makes different mistakes or not mistakes, but, you know, has different challenges?
Speaker C:Yeah, I think it's challenges.
Speaker C:I think, I think in consumer health there's a trend in the sense that it's, it's a lot focused on, I.
Speaker A:Would say, the medical solution or the scientific solution.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So often they come with, it's validated, it's based on this formulation, these ingredients, all of that.
Speaker A:And then you ask the question, okay, but what is it going to be to consumers?
Speaker A:That's not what they want to listen about.
Speaker A:They want to understand why they should be buying you and what's the need you're answering.
Speaker A:So it's.
Speaker A:This trait is very common.
Speaker C:I think what I see as well.
Speaker A:Is it's not a mistake, it's just probably a lack of time as well, because.
Speaker A:Lack of time and resources.
Speaker A:Because startups, they need to work and rent at the same time.
Speaker C:So they don't have time sometimes to do thorough investigation and they don't have the people, but they don't have time to look at the competition as well.
Speaker C:So they are very much into developing their product.
Speaker C:They are super passionate about it.
Speaker C:They believe it's the greatest product on earth and they haven't checked who else might be doing the same.
Speaker C:Again, it's really much linked to the lack of time and lack of resources.
Speaker C:These two things are very common traits that I can see.
Speaker C:And I would say the third one, yes, it's.
Speaker C:They are so passionate about their product, way more passionate.
Speaker C:But you can be, you know, when you work for a big corporate.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Because it's their baby.
Speaker C:And sometimes you have to again, work with them on, okay, it's okay, it might be your baby, but don't forget it's business as well.
Speaker C:And I think that's the third thing I would say that you see very often.
Speaker B:So do you think some of the founders mistake a good story for a good product?
Speaker C:Yes, in a sense.
Speaker C:But if you think that if we frame passion as a mistake or passion as something which can be a derailer when they face financial Investors sometimes because they are too much focused on their own stuff, it can be turned into a great story because the chance of a startup of surviving the first few years and become profitable and grow and be a good candidate for being sold with a high multiple.
Speaker C:The passion of the team is something they look at.
Speaker C:It's one of the of the key levers, right?
Speaker C:So if you structure that passion in a way and if you turn it into something which is not going to be again a derailer in terms of the CEO of others not wanting to change something because sometimes that the derailleur that can happen.
Speaker C:It's a formidable thing for a startup.
Speaker C:You absolutely need that.
Speaker C:I don't believe any team lacking passion has ever succeeded in a startup world.
Speaker C:I don't think it's possible.
Speaker B:When someone comes to you with an idea, can you tell like in the first five minutes if this is something good?
Speaker B:Also did you once think oh, this is something fantastic and it turned out to be nothing or vice versa?
Speaker C:It's super interesting question you're asking.
Speaker C:I don't think you can prevent yourself from having a gut reaction to what you're seeing, right.
Speaker C:So especially if it's in the woman's health territory, like oh, I'm going to listen even better.
Speaker C:I think that you may get a sense but sometimes you have to really dig to, to understand whether it's a, it's a great idea.
Speaker C:And again, often I think it's linked to a couple of key things which is, okay, the idea might sound great, is it really differentiated and maybe you can't get that in five minutes because you need to do a thorough exercise and you may not know the category and is there anything coming from competition that is very close to that.
Speaker C:So the whole differentiation thing is, is a key one.
Speaker C:I worked with a supplement company, they work with one lead ingredient.
Speaker C:And when I met with them and they talked to me about the product and the ingredient, I was like, whoa, that's amazing.
Speaker A:Amazing.
Speaker C:And that's the only ingredient used in some of the clinical trials to talk about autophagy, you know, for that type of ingredient.
Speaker C:And I was like, oh, that's.
Speaker C:That sounds really amazing.
Speaker C:And then so you're like super excited.
Speaker C:And then you start digging and you're like, oh, but there's other ingredients which might do the same thing.
Speaker C:And maybe you have some me toos or things ingredient which might be instead of natural chemicals.
Speaker C:But how is the consumer going to understand the difference?
Speaker C:So yes or no to your question?
Speaker C:I think sometimes.
Speaker C:Yet you've got the gut instinct there might be something, but you still need to, I think, verify it.
Speaker B:And what do you think is the difference between a company that is genuinely solving a problem and one that's just very good at creating a demand?
Speaker C:There's a great example at the moment of that.
Speaker C:So in the whole longevity world, you see a lot of longevity clinics appearing, right?
Speaker C:Hundreds of them appearing.
Speaker C:Maybe not every day, but you know, in every city now you have big cities, you have some.
Speaker C:Some I would say are purely funded by financial people because longevity is very trendy.
Speaker C:It makes sense to invest there.
Speaker C:There's a real, there's a need from a consumer perspective.
Speaker C:Some are funded by doctors who have been working in the not industry of longevity.
Speaker C:But you know, longevity is just a new word to say you're going to hopefully help people live longer.
Speaker C:So all the people who have been in Prevention for a while, you know, now they are maybe reframing their practice, they have a very strong foundation.
Speaker C:So on one side, I would say probably more genuine.
Speaker C:On the other side, it's way more looking at consumer needs, but demand and trying to drive that from a very economical perspective.
Speaker C:I think the jury is a bit out at the moment if I take this example in terms of which one is going to succeed.
Speaker C:I would say that the first one is probably going to succeed if they find resources and they can get scale quickly.
Speaker C:The second one, if they can find the right people to work at their clinics and the right staff with the right credentials.
Speaker C:I don't know if there's a yes or no to your question.
Speaker C:I think you can see both appearing at the same time in some categories with, for example, definitely in longevity at the end, I would say authenticity and seeing that it's way more than a transaction, there's really something behind and the people they meet are genuinely interested in advancing the health span is going to be the make or break for these practices.
Speaker C:So which one will win?
Speaker C:I don't know.
Speaker C:But I think the authenticity will definitely win the battle with consumers.
Speaker B:I've spoken to academics and university professors and people in research in general in the longevity field.
Speaker B:They came to you.
Speaker B:What advice would you give them?
Speaker B:How to make the jump, how to transition from just working in their lab and pure research and all that to entering the commercial market.
Speaker C:The very, very first advice would be stop being a scientist, start being a consumer, think like them and really think about their needs.
Speaker C:How are you going to answer the needs?
Speaker C:Not just with the launch of your new product, but for the long run.
Speaker C:So that's the very first advice because again, and it's not a criticism to the researchers, the medical doctors, all of that, but they've been exposed to sometimes like closed work of academics and sometimes exposed to what they call patients, which are very different from consumers.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:Patients suffer from a sickness.
Speaker C:Patients are people who are a bit captive compared to consumers.
Speaker C:Consumers consume.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And they are going to trade off as well.
Speaker C:So it's, it's not absolutely not the same relationship.
Speaker C:So that's the very first thing.
Speaker C:The second thing would be if they, if they want to be successful long term when they launch their business, they have to work on the economic model very much early on.
Speaker C:Consumers first, economic model the second.
Speaker C:Because you may waste a lot of time thinking about a concept, an idea, a product, a service, all of that, but if you haven't found a way to make it financially viable, there's no point.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:Again, you're not working in the academics work, you're working in a world where in the end there's a need for money, there will be people paying for it or there will be insurances paying for it or you know, so it's, it's, it's very different.
Speaker C:So these would be the very, very.
Speaker B:First two things continuing with that researcher and sort of scientific theme.
Speaker B:When a company says it's science backed, what should the public actually expect that to mean?
Speaker B:What do you think it ought to mean?
Speaker C:There's, there's different levels.
Speaker C:So, and I think it depends also on the categories where you work.
Speaker C:But if I take the example of skincare where I category but I know science backed can be because the company has, has made just the bare minimum tests to be on the market, but we can still tick the box, science based.
Speaker C:So in Europe, when you want to launch a skincare brand, there's some complementary tests you have to do, which are patch tests.
Speaker C:So just to check of course that the skincare product you apply on the hand or the face is not going to be irritating, which would be a massive issue.
Speaker C:So you can still have dermatologically tested as a claim and in a way, you know, for consumers it kind of science backlight, but it's the bare minimum.
Speaker C:You have other companies who are really going to go beyond that and they are going to do clinical trials, they are going to test the efficacy of the products on some different metrics, whether it's reducing wrinkles, helping hydration, all these claims that you can see coming from skincare brands and they do these clinical trials at scale.
Speaker C:So it's not just 10 people, it's way more.
Speaker C:They do it over a long period of time.
Speaker C:So maybe not 24 hours, 48 hours, but a few weeks.
Speaker C:As you can imagine, it's way more costly, but it's probably where you can get a better reassurance as a consumers in the sense that the product is really going to deliver something.
Speaker C:And again, it's science fact.
Speaker C:So what I would advise consumers of people to do is really to again go and look at what's behind science back the way companies are doing their tests and really backing up their products and services.
Speaker B:I mean, at the moment longevity is such a trendy word, such a hype.
Speaker B:Everybody wants to jump on that bandwagon of longevity and all that.
Speaker B:Do you think it's become a little bit the wild west with everybody making various promises that are more or less science backed?
Speaker B:So my question really is, do you think that the longevity space has a credibility problem at the moment or will soon have a credibility problem?
Speaker C:I think it has at the moment, definitely.
Speaker C:I think it's quite normal for that category to be in that stage.
Speaker C:So when you look at the theory of formation of categories or companies, right, there's are born, they are nascent and then they grow and then there's chaos and then there's consolidation potentially and then of course less and less companies and then you end up with the best one surviving.
Speaker C:It's a bit this Darwinism model, right.
Speaker C:As well at the end, I think longevity is in the chaos mode at the moment.
Speaker C:It's still only for a few, right.
Speaker C:And it, because we work in it, I think we believe it's huge.
Speaker C:It hasn't reached the masses yet.
Speaker C:Yet, Right.
Speaker C:It's still with a small proportion of the population, the investments which are going there are growing.
Speaker C:But still compared to other, you know, categories like AI and all of that.
Speaker C:Of, of course it, it's very small, but within it it's the wild, wild west because regulations do not exist for some of the things.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So some of the categories like food supplements, yes.
Speaker C:In Europe you may have more regulation, but in the US it's really you.
Speaker C:You see claims appearing on Paxil, which on websites, all of that and you're like, these claims can't be true because you promised me not eternal life, but almost.
Speaker C:Right, so yeah, there you have again, we talked about it, but lots of clinics opening with all these different tests and I think you can get lost in terms of understanding which one is really relevant, which one is really funded.
Speaker C:There's all these different types of doctors as well, which appear some of them are no credentials in terms of medical knowledge or nothing, but they are just great speakers.
Speaker C:So yes, it's a bit the wild, wild west.
Speaker C:I think we seen, I would say probably some scandals.
Speaker C:A few of these influence big names recently have made the news.
Speaker C:Whether it's because the way they were doing the substantiation for some of the products they were selling was not in line with protocols that are clinically validated.
Speaker C:Others because it was just business for them.
Speaker C:So even though there were doctors maybe behind was not, you know, very genuine.
Speaker C:So we see that appearing now and I think it's going to continue and it's going to get bigger till we reach a point where I think there would be regulation, consumers would be doing also their research.
Speaker C:And I think some of these companies will be way in the hands of either big corporates or in the hands also of private equities or big groups.
Speaker C:They will have to have way more disciplined and rigorous approaches to what they do.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And of course that will definitely help in the end.
Speaker B:You've always been a big advocate for women and women's health just in general, for women to thrive, health wise, work wise in life in general.
Speaker B:Do you feel that this whole longevity market is targeting women and is sort of mixing up between what healthy aging is and what helps them and what doesn't and what they need versus what they ought to take?
Speaker B:Do you think it's become a big business rather than actual support for women?
Speaker C:I might be a bit provocative here, but I do believe it has to become a big business.
Speaker C:So the needs of women in when it comes to their health will be served.
Speaker C:Women's health has been underserved, under looked at, under diagnosed for too many years.
Speaker C:When you think about it, there was numbers, I think it's from last year which were saying like only 2% of investments from venture capitals in health are going to women's health.
Speaker C:I mean this is.
Speaker C:That number is so small that it's not significant.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:There's many reasons for that.
Speaker C: You know, until: Speaker C:So everything which had been, except for specific women's health issues, which means that at the moment we may not have the right treatments or bodies have been considered like bodies, small men bodies in a way.
Speaker C:So pool market, I would say of women's health needs to be business oriented.
Speaker C:So we get products, services and we get treatments that are adequate for us.
Speaker C:The reason I'm saying it's a bit provocative, it's that it's Business led.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:So we can also imagine, you know, what, what it means that there could be issues with, is it genuine, is it authentic, is it going to serve the needs of women?
Speaker C:Hopefully, yes.
Speaker C:So when you look at the US where I think it's probably 90% of investments which are being made there, you have some amazing companies which have been born thanks to that.
Speaker C: ally young, which was born in: Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And she has been suffering from perimenopause and menopause symptoms.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And she was.
Speaker C:Her needs were not served at all.
Speaker C:And she knew a bit about digital platform from her background and she thought, okay, how do I help women there?
Speaker C:And she founded that platform, which is dedicated to helping women who go through this phase of their lives and get access to doctors, get access to treatment.
Speaker C:The whole business is part of some health insurance platforms as well in the US Some bigger ones.
Speaker C:So she thought about that as well.
Speaker C:So it's not just for the, the privileged ones.
Speaker C: millions since: Speaker C:So I think we can make both work, I. E. Business and genuine, serving really the needs of women.
Speaker C:And I think that's the only way.
Speaker C:The reality is governments don't have the funds now to go and do research on women's health in the way they should.
Speaker C:So scale might not be there.
Speaker C:Speed is absolutely needed.
Speaker C:The population is aging.
Speaker C:Women live, they live on average five years longer than men, but they live up to 25% of their life in poor health, especially potentially the latter years.
Speaker C:So imagine the cost for every economy.
Speaker C:So governments are into a sick care mode, not a healthcare mode or prevention mode, and they can't invest there.
Speaker C:They look definitely at curing diseases and all of that.
Speaker C:That's the first priority.
Speaker C:But prevention is absolutely key in women's health, so it has to come from the business world.
Speaker B:So what do you think?
Speaker B:A workplace that genuinely understood women's health span, what should they do differently or the way it's working?
Speaker B:What do they do differently and what can other companies learn from it?
Speaker C:Yes, I think a very interesting data is that we think, you know, health issues arise when you get older.
Speaker C:With women, it's not the case.
Speaker C:50% Of the diseases that they are going to face is during the time they work.
Speaker C:And when I talk disease, it can be disease, which are, you know, severe diseases.
Speaker C:Of course, you think about cancers and all of that, but also debilitating disease like endometriosis, migraine pain, and all of that.
Speaker C:So the effect of that is when they are at work, they might not be performing well.
Speaker C:And so for companies not supporting these women, when they go through these episodes of pain or helping them, you know, cope with them, maybe some mental health issues they might be facing, or, you know, the fact they have to care for older adults as well, which is giving them a lot of stress, is a massive issue because they may quit work or they may go on sick leave.
Speaker C:So there's a lot of productivity being lost for these companies.
Speaker C:And if they quit, then there's a loss of talent as well.
Speaker C:So the companies which have understood that, and some of them have, which is great, what they put in place is definitely internal programs to help women understand what they go through.
Speaker C:Because again we, we are fully immersed in the whole perimenopause menopause world because we talk about that all day long when you work in longevity and especially in women's health.
Speaker C:But for a lot of women, all the symptoms they go through are still completely unknown.
Speaker C:And when they go through that at work, they might feel a lot isolated.
Speaker C:So if you just focus on that, which is a critical phase in the life of a woman at work, putting in place some programs to help them understand what the symptoms are, having some groups that they can join to talk about it, feeling listened by their manager as well, all things that some companies have put in place.
Speaker C:I met last year on Women's International Day, in fact, which was interesting, a few companies, one of them being Roche, big pharma company, and they were putting in place a menopause program.
Speaker C:And I think it, you know, they were saying they had a huge demand and of course you have to push and you have to make sure these programs continue.
Speaker C:But I think these kind of initiatives are absolutely crucial.
Speaker C:The other one, which I think is not there yet, but which is probably absolutely needed is the fact that all of these supports probably need to be part of the yearly objectives of managers and executives.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:It needs to be a KPI like probably others to make sure that it's not just a one off and then it's going to continue and they fully understand the positive impact it can bring if they have that in place.
Speaker B:Do you think companies understand that the.
Speaker C:Ones which are led by women.
Speaker C:Yes.
Speaker C:It's interesting to see that a lot of women's health companies, startups, scale ups, are led by women.
Speaker C:I gave the example of MIDI Health, but there's also Eli Health, which is this company that developed like it's a device that you can use at home and with your saliva, it's going to test your hormonal level.
Speaker C:Again funded by a woman within these companies.
Speaker C:They do understand that that and they know how to take care of their woman in other companies.
Speaker C:I think there's still a lot of work to do and you can see that through the number of women who reached the executive level.
Speaker C:The percentage is still very low.
Speaker C:And it, I think in a way it's a proof that there's probably at some stage some care which is not given to the woman in these companies and the care that would help them when they face some difficult issues, go beyond these obstacles and reach the highest level.
Speaker C:For me, it's one of the key proof that it's not there yet.
Speaker B:Let's move on from women in business to women as consumers.
Speaker B:The longevity field has recently, I'll say, become a very crowded space for women's longevity in particular.
Speaker B:Do you see that as a progress or do you think the market just sort of found an easy target because women anyway want to look after themselves?
Speaker B:And you know, longevity is also often marketed as a beauty field to look younger, to look healthier.
Speaker C:I think you're right when you say that there is link between beauty and health.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:We can read loads of articles now about beauty is health and health is beauty.
Speaker C:The new status for very wealthy people is looking healthy and hence beautiful.
Speaker C:There's definitely this mix now happening.
Speaker C:I think that yes, there's investments going there, but we have to again look at the numbers.
Speaker C:It's still not there.
Speaker C:It's still not 50% of investments in health that are going to women's health.
Speaker C:So again, I think there's a lot of hype.
Speaker C:It's talked a lot on social media and maybe beyond that in maybe in some investors forums and all that, but yet the numbers are not there.
Speaker C:So I think the proofs are not coming in yet.
Speaker C:Again, I think that women do want to take care of themselves, but they've been too taught to take care of themselves very superficially up to now.
Speaker C:So to your point, it's linked to beauty.
Speaker C:I think where they are still not in a way potentially educated is really taking care of themselves holistically.
Speaker C:So I'm a big, big advocate of muscle health for women.
Speaker C:Reason behind that is one of the key reasons of death is when you fall, and especially women, because they suffer from osteoporosis linked to menopause.
Speaker C:And if you haven't worked on your strength and your muscle health, your risk of falling and indirectly dying from your fall is super High strength training is picking up, but it's still seen as something very scary for women.
Speaker C:They would go and do yoga, they might run, they might do Pilates.
Speaker C:When, when it comes to muscle health, it's still not there.
Speaker C:So the foundations of what really is health for women is not fully understood.
Speaker C:And one of the key proofs of that is when you see the success of Ozempic and all the GLP1 stuff, unless you are supervised by a doctor and you really are all the weight and you really need that, I think that's a different story.
Speaker C:Right, but women who now take Ozenpic or others, you know, because they want to get skinny and thin very quickly at the detriment of their strength and muscles and long term health is a proof that they haven't understood yet what's the foundation of healthspan.
Speaker C:So the battle is not won at all.
Speaker B:The battle probably hasn't even started properly.
Speaker C:Oh, properly, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker B:If a woman who hasn't started this journey yet, if a woman is listening to this and just feels she's being hit from, you know, from every angle, supplements, hormone advice, biomarker testing, skin care, wearables, wellness, how and where would you tell her to think about where to begin?
Speaker C:I think the very, very first step for her would be to do an assessment of her health.
Speaker C:And when I say that, I'm not saying she should spend thousands of dollars or euros or pounds or Swiss francs on all these tests offered by longevity clinics, which are a lot into optimization.
Speaker C:I would start with going to my GP and ask for really like blood tests, but like a very, very complete list of tests often reimbursed by, you know, your health insurance and already identify there what could be the key issues you have.
Speaker C:Whether you lack iron, which is very common with women and which can be easily looked at.
Speaker C:Whether you are at risk of diabetes, again can be easily looked at.
Speaker C:So all these measures, which are really the foundations of probably your health, that's really the first thing.
Speaker C:The second thing is the.
Speaker C:There's a test that is also great, I think to do, which again is not expensive, is to look at your weight.
Speaker C:And women love looking at their weight.
Speaker C:But look at the composition of your body weight.
Speaker C:So your fat, this is your muscle mass, your visceral fat, because these are things that are going to help you understand.
Speaker C:Do you have a real issue, I. E. Visceral fat is a, is a big issue long term.
Speaker C:What do you need to improve?
Speaker C:Do you need to improve, of course, your muscle mass because you are really under.
Speaker C:Are you average, do you need maybe to lose a bit of weight really?
Speaker C:Or is it okay?
Speaker C:And if you work on your muscle mass, it might compensate.
Speaker C:So the first advice for me is get, you know, some of your metrics in place and again, the very simple ones, right, the foundational ones.
Speaker C:Then I would say there are some very, some key levers where you, you don't need to spend again a lot of money or think supplementation and everything else.
Speaker C:It's like, do you have enough sleep?
Speaker C:Sleep is one of them.
Speaker C:Again, the key levers in terms of health span, there's really a lot of data now correlating the lack of sleep with mental health issues long term, of course, physical decline and all of that.
Speaker C:So if you sleep less than six hours per night, there might be an issue long term.
Speaker C:So think about your sleep.
Speaker C:If you had sleep issues, go and talk to your doctor, think about, you know, do you do enough exercise, do you go outdoor?
Speaker C:So the sleep, nutrition, have your basics in place as well, do you also do enough exercise per day?
Speaker C:And again, not all of us and not all women can afford doing one hour or two hours of exercise per day, right?
Speaker C:We have a lot of things to do juggle with whether it's your work, your husband, your kids, your parents you take care of and everything, right?
Speaker C:But do you walk a bit?
Speaker C:Do you, instead of taking the lift, do you walk, do you do a break every hour to bring down your cortisol?
Speaker C:So all these things that maybe you can optimize, do you definitely see your friends?
Speaker C:Social connection is also a key one.
Speaker C:And you know, do you call them, do you, you know, on a weekend, do you spend a bit of time with them, with your family, do you go outdoor?
Speaker C:So before going to all these fancy optimization things that you can see, which can be absolutely great when you already have your foundations in place, really start with the foundations and start with an assessment of where you are today.
Speaker B:No, it's all very good and sound advice.
Speaker B:The other side of the coin, what do you think women are spending too much money, too much energy and too much attention on right now that you think is either worthless or just not that important?
Speaker C:I've recently read one quote which made me laugh because I worked for that industry for many years, which was when women are going to be confident about their appearance.
Speaker C:There's a lot of businesses which are going to collapse.
Speaker C:The whole industry is going to collapse, right?
Speaker C:So I would say feeling good when you look into the mirror is a good thing because of course it's going to help Your confidence and all that.
Speaker C:But when it goes beyond that and when it becomes a bit of an obsession, when you spend all your money into skin care, injections or more, I think that's where for me it can be an issue first, because it's an addiction.
Speaker C:Very often when everything related to injections and all that can be seen as an.
Speaker C:Definitely as an addiction.
Speaker C:And again, when you age, you're going to get wrinkles.
Speaker C:You may reduce some of them, but you're going to get some.
Speaker C:And I think that when there's going to be a massive disconnect between your appearance, which is going to look super young, and your inside, which might be your gut, your liver, your heart, all of these things internally have aged.
Speaker C:This is what's going to make your number of years of life real.
Speaker C:Right?
Speaker C:So my advice is spend your money on the foundations and not on the superficial, really.
Speaker C:I think when it comes to supplements, again, be wise for there.
Speaker C:Take only what's needed because you might be tempted to go for a lot, but they might not be needed.
Speaker C:They might do nothing to you and you should take them in too much quantity as well.
Speaker C:They might even be a bit harmful.
Speaker C:So be careful.
Speaker B:Do you personally worry that longevity, for all its promises and good intentions, could become something that only privileged women can really have access to?
Speaker C:Well, it's currently the case.
Speaker C:In fact, it's very much the case because you are very privileged when you, you can afford time for you during the day, when you're a woman, right?
Speaker C:The reality is that the more health you have, the more you can do that.
Speaker C:Because very pragmatically, you may have a cleaner, a cleaning lady at your place and you don't have to spend time cleaning.
Speaker C:You may have someone, a nanny to pick up your kids, and maybe during that time, maybe you can spend a bit of time for yourself.
Speaker C:Right, so.
Speaker C:So clearly at the moment, I would say that the more privileged you are from a financial perspective, the more you can take care of your health.
Speaker C:Whether you do it or not is another story.
Speaker C:But the more you have time and potential to do it, you know, if you're a woman who needs to spend two hours in the morning taking a train to go to work very early in the morning, and then you spend eight hours there, you come back, you still have everything to do for your family.
Speaker C:I mean, the reality is that you will definitely not take care of your health, most probably, right?
Speaker C:And it's going to be an issue long term.
Speaker B:So do you think with all this advice and advances and all that we are helping women to live better for longer, or do you think it's just simply giving them, you know, yet another list of things to do and to optimize and to do better?
Speaker C:I'm a firm believer that when you empower women and you educate them and you give them a bit of space, you know, in the workforce, in your company, to take care of their health, it will grab the opportunity.
Speaker C:And I think if they can be, you know, if they have a support, the community support around them as well, they'll definitely go for it.
Speaker C:I'd also think very realistically that we as a community and as humanity, we don't honestly don't have a choice.
Speaker C:We should really do that because otherwise we are going to face a massive issue from, you know, if I put my business hat on an economic perspective, if I put my green hat on an environmental perspective.
Speaker C:Just on the last one, two years ago, there was a report published by.
Speaker C:It's a platform, it's called the SHIFT project, French platform.
Speaker C:And it's basically they look at different massive issues from an environmental perspective and it's done by a pool of experts coming from very different horizons.
Speaker C:So it's highly recognized from a scientific perspective.
Speaker C:And so two years ago they published a report looking at health.
Speaker C:So the whole healthcare world, right?
Speaker C:And in France, the whole healthcare world, so including the production of drugs, the transport of patients, hospitals, everything, right, is causing 9% of the emission of carbon dioxide.
Speaker C:When we know that the population is going to age, when we know that it's going to be women who are going to survive, but they are going to survive maybe in poor health.
Speaker C:And if we continue this way, not educating, educating them, that might even get worse.
Speaker C:That number of 9% is going to explode and the whole ecosystem is probably going to collapse at some stage, right?
Speaker C:Women are the center of many things.
Speaker C:So I know I'm sounding a bit gloomy here, but I think there's an urgent need to make sure that women can access education and can access some of these very basic, basic foundations of health plan, because otherwise I think we will all suffer from that, really.
Speaker B:I also don't want to sound too gloomy, but what do you think the industry as a whole is still not saying loudly enough because it's less commercially convenient or less commercially of interest.
Speaker C:I think there's a whole model to shift as well.
Speaker C:If you think about the healthcare industry, it's very much been dominated by the big pharma, the big academics, which have been looking at a sick care model and the sick care model is linked to people are sick, they get a cure, we invest into finding a cure, we train doctors and all that into.
Speaker C:In France we call that kind of war medicine, right?
Speaker C:It's, we are getting amazing at prothesis and changing a leg and getting people to survive from some of the most difficult cancers and all of that.
Speaker C:But the money spent into prevention and helping people have a lifestyle that's going to either eradicate or reduce chronic diseases by 50 to 70% is not the current business model.
Speaker C:The investments of the companies are still, still going into drug development, curing people from a disease, right?
Speaker C:So it's a difficult shift and that's why some of these companies are shifting, some of these are investing.
Speaker C:So if you take Abbott for example, they are well known for playing in diabetes, right?
Speaker C:And insulin delivering system or system that are going to track your glucose index when you're suffering from diabetes type 2, right.
Speaker C:Or type 1.
Speaker C:Now they have understood that 90% of the people who suffer from diabetes in fact do not need to take insulin.
Speaker C:But they need support.
Speaker C:But they might not switch to having to get insulin one day to get that right support.
Speaker C:So they are launching this glucose monitoring device that they position, a device that as a consumer you can buy because it's helping you with your lifestyle.
Speaker C:So there is economic growth to be, to be looked at and to be grabbed.
Speaker C:But you need a mindset shift, right?
Speaker C:It's coming from big corporates, it's coming from other companies like Oora for example, that everyone probably know, you know this ring, you know, manufacturer, right?
Speaker C:Ring connected ring manufacturer.
Speaker C:Their valuation is getting immense now.
Speaker C:I think last week it was about $11 billion.
Speaker C:They invest 9 to women's health.
Speaker C:They, they, you know, they have programs dedicated to them.
Speaker C:So that's coming.
Speaker C:But the shifts needs to be way quicker than now.
Speaker C:And some of the big business models which have worked in the past need to be completely changed.
Speaker C:So that's a big one.
Speaker B:This might be a, you know, a tough question or an impossible question to answer, but how quickly do you think these shifts are going to come?
Speaker B:And not just for the couple of companies, but overall for the, for the big majority.
Speaker C:It's going to be probably country dependent when it comes to the masses, right?
Speaker C:Because there's a need for a realization from the governments that they need to really push for change with the academics, with the big pharma companies in their country.
Speaker C:And there's a push really needed there.
Speaker C:And they also need to make sure that prevention is going to be a model that is incentivized with consumers, right?
Speaker C:So at the moment, if you live in France, you have the Social Security model and you may have private health insurance, right?
Speaker C:Yet if you want to go and see an osteopath, or if you want to go and see a nutritionist, or if you want to go and see some people who can help into the prevention arena, it is partially reimbursed, or not even reimbursed at all.
Speaker C:Because at the moment the model from a also, you know, is incentivized again against treatment.
Speaker C:So once governments as well will push as well the national security insurances, when there are some to shift the model that can help reaching the masses.
Speaker C:And so that's one side and the other side is for me the.
Speaker C:The whole academic world, right?
Speaker C:How fast can they support startups, maybe in some of the big universities which are working on that, how do we allocate funds to look into prevention?
Speaker C:The rate of speed might be very country dependent.
Speaker C:We have a formidable power when we face a massive issue.
Speaker C:Covid is a proof, right?
Speaker C:I just hope that we won't have to be at that stage for change to happen, but we don't need to be in the very traumatic situation to make a shift.
Speaker C:It will have to happen at that stage, that's for sure.
Speaker C:But hopefully it will happen before.
Speaker B:What is your hope for the longevity field as a whole in the next couple of years?
Speaker B:Where do you see it going and where do you hope it will go?
Speaker C:So my hope, and I see it will come because that's the natural phase.
Speaker C:But my hope is that the whole field is going to stop being the wild, wild west.
Speaker C:Longevity is going to become a category where consumers cannot be fooled.
Speaker C:That's my hope.
Speaker C:And whatever amount of money they want to spend in it, what they will get is going to deliver.
Speaker C:So that's the hope, I think.
Speaker C:I think that very wealthy people, people who are these biohackers have been served or you know, have now put in place some longevity hacks and a lot of companies have addressed that core target.
Speaker C:I hope that, you know, the next level which is reaching everyone interested in health, is going to happen very quickly because that's usually the progression that you can see and it's a way bigger audience as well.
Speaker C:And I just hope that the masses, which I would say the third level will come quickly after that because of the economic situation every country is facing from a health perspective and economic perspective and environmental perspective.
Speaker C:So in a way, I hope that funnel that we usually see in terms of going to the core target, early adopters to the masses will happen quicker than it usually does.
Speaker B:Very positive note to end on after our few gloomy points in the middle.
Speaker C:No, I know.
Speaker B:In the end I always ask my guest five rapid fire questions.
Speaker B:So you're no exceptions.
Speaker B:I'm going to ask you those as well.
Speaker C:Go for it.
Speaker B:What is the single best piece of advice you would give your younger self?
Speaker C:Start early.
Speaker C:Start early.
Speaker C:Because we think longevity is for the old people and it's not the case.
Speaker C:Start early.
Speaker B:Name one habit everyone should adopt for a longer, healthier life.
Speaker C:Be a sleeping beauty.
Speaker B:If you weren't in longevity science and the longevity field, what career would you have chosen?
Speaker C:Integrative health.
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:Microdose habits.
Speaker B:Sort of five minute routine or small daily action yields outsized longevity benefits.
Speaker C:Grieving technique to lower your stress.
Speaker B:And what's the craziest longevity myth you've encountered?
Speaker B:And is there any truth to it?
Speaker C:Oof.
Speaker C:Oh, that's a tough one.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:There's so many crazy things out there, right?
Speaker C:Oh yeah, I know.
Speaker C:I need to think about the crazy one.
Speaker A:It may sound crazy when you talk about it, but the whole walking barefoot thing, I think we all remember Pretty Woman, right?
Speaker A:And with your gear, walking barefoot at the end of a movie, like a real ladder.
Speaker A:Oh my God, no, no.
Speaker A:Red Soul.
Speaker C:It's such a, you know, it means nothing.
Speaker A:La la la.
Speaker A:And in fact, as the lady discovered, that there is a lot of science behind that and that basically because of electric fields, you know, between your body and the earth, this is in fact walking barefoot on grass is a really great thing again to help with your cortisol.
Speaker C:So it sounds a bit crazy when.
Speaker A:You give the advice, right?
Speaker A:It sounds a bit bipnic and like.
Speaker C:But it's an advice really backed by science.
Speaker C:So there is one.
Speaker B:You know, I heard that too actually recently or I read a study on it.
Speaker B:It's very interesting.
Speaker A:You know, you have a one doing.
Speaker C:Listening to birds, which again is super interesting because you feel like, oh, that's, you know, again, that sounds a bit silly, all that our body is not that different from, you know, the body of 30,000 years ago.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:And 30,000 years ago, when humans could listen to birds, they knew that they were not in danger.
Speaker C:And apparently it has impacted our ways of processing the sound of birds and it's a calming thing.
Speaker C:Another one.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:On another note, you know, they've made these studies that patients recovering from operations, if they look out of the window and they see nature, trees, whatever, nature in general, they recover much faster than the ones that look at urban cities or don't have any view at all.
Speaker B:That's really crazy because they're not even in nature.
Speaker B:They're just.
Speaker C:Just looking.
Speaker B:Looking at it through a glass.
Speaker C:No, no, absolutely.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:And that's why some of the companies are developing the virtual reality mask, especially for patients who are, you know, suffer from depression and mental illnesses.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:And Alzheimer.
Speaker C:So, yeah, there's things behind that.
Speaker C:Absolutely.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Back to basics.
Speaker C:Exactly.
Speaker B:Thank you so much.
Speaker B:This was just so much fun and such a great talk.
Speaker B:I love it.
Speaker B:You are so interesting with all your experience, experience and everything you've achieved.
Speaker B:It was such a pleasure to talk to you.
Speaker B:Really, all these different angles we touched.
Speaker B:Thank you so much.
Speaker C:Thank you for the interview or discussion.
Speaker C:It was really interesting as well.
Speaker C:Yeah, I loved it.
Speaker A:Yeah, really?
Speaker B:That was Corinne Briode Manon on Beyond Longevity.
Speaker B:Corinne sees the longevity speaker not just through the lens of health, but through the lens of business trust and execution.
Speaker B:And that matters because if this field is going to mature, and it will, it cannot rely on good intentions, glossy branding or vague promises.
Speaker B:It has to deliver something real.
Speaker B:We spoke about women being underserved, but also about something broader.
Speaker B:The risk that longevity becomes yet another market full of noise, pressure and products, rather than a serious effort to help people live better for longer.
Speaker B:If this episode made you think differently about women's healthspan consumer trust or where this whole sector may be heading, do share it with someone else who would enjoy it and follow beyond law longevity so you do not miss the next conversation.
